| Introduction
This interview was with Crystal Womble (formerly Clements). Mrs. Womble was
a student at Booker T. Washington Elementary when it was a segregated
neighborhood school. She is the younger sister of Dereke Clements and
attended Centennial High School. She is outreach director at the Krannert
Center for the Performing Arts at UIUC.
Gabrielle Ceaser, a 7th grader at Franklin Middle School, conducted the
interview. Danielle Russell, an 8th grader at Franklin, engineered the
interview. Gabrielle and Danielle are two of 12 Franklin Middle School
students and two Central High School students (graduates of last year’s
radio program) working with WILL-AM 580 on an oral history project
documenting the actual desegregation of Champaign’s public elementary
schools in 1968. The students used parts of this interview for their
60-minute radio documentary, More Than a Bus Ride: Desegregating Champaign
Public Schools.
Gabrielle conducted the interview on March 8, 2005, at the WILL-AM 580
studio, 300 N. Goodwin Ave. in Urbana, IL.
GABBY: Please state your full name.
MRS. WOMBLE: Crystal Womble.
GABBY: Where were you born?
MRS. WOMBLE: I was born in Champaign at a hospital called Burnham hospital
that no longer exists.
GABBY: Um, who named you?
MRS. WOMBLE: I think it was either my mother or my aunt.
GABBY: Do you have a nickname?
MRS. WOMBLE: No - <laughs> and I’m glad.
GABBY: Where did you grow up?
MRS. WOMBLE: I grew up in Champaign - the area just to the north of Douglas
park.
GABBY: What year were you born?
MRS. WOMBLE: I was born in 1956.
GABBY: Do you have any children?
MRS. WOMBLE: I do. We have two daughters. Our oldest daughter is 29 and our
youngest daughter is 27. And then we have a 17 year old – or – I’m sorry – a
16 year old son.
GABBY: What’s their names?
MRS. WOMBLE: The oldest is Monisha and the youngest girl is Maya and then
our son is Matthew.
GABBY: What part of town did you grow up in?
MRS. WOMBLE: We grew up - as I was mentioning - just north of Douglas park –
pretty much within the three or four block radius from Eureka. 5th, and at
one point 6th…so pretty much within a two or three block range from Douglas
park.
GABBY: Was your neighborhood predominantly black or white?
MRS. WOMBLE: At the time it was predominantly black. There were a few mixed
races that were there at that time but not as many as what you see today.
GABBY: How did you relate to one another?
MRS. WOMBLE: Mmm…as far as neighborhoods or people in the neighborhood?
People in the neighborhood and people in general in Champaign – it was at
that time a pretty close knit community so everybody knew everybody,
families were very recognizable, whereas now I think it’s changed quite a
bit. And you had a good mix of elderly, kids, you know – singles…but mostly
families.
GABBY: Where do you live now? In which town and what part?
MRS. WOMBLE: Um, we’re still in Champaign county but we are in Urbana now.
GABBY: Which schools did you go to - junior high, high school and college?
MRS. WOMBLE: Ok. Junior high school I went to Franklin and then high school
my sophomore year I went to Central High School and then we moved which put
us in a different district – a different zone so I finished out high school
at Centennial.
GABBY: I go to Franklin.
MRS. WOMBLE: Oh, ok. Go Franklin.
GABBY: Did you like Franklin?
MRS. WOMBLE: It was a pretty good school at that time. A lot of the – there
was some bussing but a lot of the neighborhood kids…kids that I grew up with
and – went to elementary school which was at B.T. Washington at that time it
was still – Washington was an all black school and I think even the teachers
– the principal was black and I remember some of the teachers there were
white but mostly it was all black.
GABBY: Do you have brothers and sisters and did they go to the same schools
as you?
MRS. WOMBLE: I do have…I’ve got two older brothers and two younger sisters
and we all went through the same schools with the exception of a couple of
times when we moved I had a sister who’s four years younger than I am attend
a different junior high. She actually went to – I think it was Edison at the
time and my brother went to Jefferson. But then we all ended up graduating
from Centennial.
GABBY: Which of your schools were segregated and which were integrated?
MRS. WOMBLE: The segregated school as I mentioned was Washington and at that
time it was elementary so the lower grades…and then from then on the schools
had started to become segregated by the time I was old enough to go to
junior high.
GABBY: What was your school-
KIMBERLI E (Project Co-Director: Excuse me – I’m going to interrupt…ok so,
you had talked about going to Washington school, which was primarily all
black in student population and also mostly teachers. And then you went to a
junior high, which was integrated. Can you just tell Gabby what it was like
for you to go from one experience – one environment into another?
MRS. WOMBLE: Mhm. Ok, sure. Um, I think the difference in the experience was
the teachers knew you as well as knowing your family. So if there was a
situation or concern on the teacher’s part for any reason whatsoever it was
nothing to see that teacher either at your house or hear a phone
conversation with that teacher and my mom so I think it was an environment
where there was a – for me it seemed like there was a belief in the fact
that you could learn, no matter who you were or what your background…and
then the fact also that there was a lot of follow-up between the teachers
and the parents. Once we got to Franklin there were some similarities but
there were a lot of differences in that same way.
GABBY: Do you have any other school experiences when you were growing up?
MRS. WOMBLE: Mhm. Um…I did go to Parkland. I didn’t graduate but took some
courses over probably a two year period, changed majors a couple of time but
most of the background was either customer service or at that time they had
a program called secretarial science, which then sort of morphed into more
computer skills.
GABBY: What age were you in 1968?
MRS. WOMBLE: Oh, good question. <laughs> If I graduated in ’74, I am 48 now
so in ’68 – oh someone help me with the math…
KIMBERLIE: We’ll figure it out later.
MRS. WOMBLE: Ok, thanks.
GABBY: Do you remember what Champaign was like in 1968?
MRS. WOMBLE: I do remember what it was like in ’68. I think there were a lot
of changes going on in a lot of different ways…um…I remember working at –
getting a job at JC PENNY, which was then downtown Champaign, and I could
remember there were very few black people that were working there and I
remember hearing stories from people who were much older – from the elders
in the community about the protest to hire black people at the store. You
know, you could shop there but you couldn’t work there – that kind of thing
was going on and I think there was a lot of angst over that whole situation.
But by the time I was employed there you know, everything was ok - you could
tell that there were still some tensions but pretty much for the most part
you know, that’s what the situation was like. So people were starting to get
into some different areas, some different opportunities were becoming a
little more available for black folks.
GABBY: What was your climate like?
MRS. WOMBLE: Climate meaning…the atmosphere in the community or at? Um, like
I said it was – everything was still pretty close knit, I think people were
starting to – because opportunities for black people had started to change,
different relationships were formed. I mean you could start seeing there
were more friendships, for example, at Centennial. The year that I started
going there was I believe the year – maybe a year or two after there were
some really serious problems because of the segregation and the bussing
issues…I can remember my older brothers talking about days when the busses
would pull up and there would be white students that were waiting outside.
They had made up in their minds that we weren’t welcome at their school and
they decided that they were going to take matters into their own hands and
it got pretty nasty. I wasn’t part of that but I can remember my older
brothers and their friends talking about that – that situation.
GABBY: What were your challenges and struggles?
KIMBERLIE: Ok Gabby, let’s stop. So you’ve heard some of this before, right?
Mr. Griggs talked about…uh Mrs. Smith talked about this being met by white
students after you get off the bus so let’s pursue that a little bit. What
might you ask to continue with that thought? What were you curious about
what she just said? Anything strike a note with you?
GABBY: How did your brothers feel?
MRS. WOMBLE: I think they were – that’s a good question. I think they were
angry, they were surprised, they were probably a little fearful but
determined that this was a situation that if – if it presented itself then
they would respond accordingly, meaning that it was kind of tooth and tooth
– you know, “We’re supposed to be here, we have a right to be here,” and I
think that I remember my brother talking about how the bus driver was just
absolutely shaken. He didn’t know whether to open the door, to pull off, to
– you know, what do you do? Um, and I can’t remember them saying how things
were resolved – if after the fighting had happened…or was it during the
fighting that administrators were called in and police came and that kind of
thing. Um, but I’m sure there was a lot going through their minds – mainly
just anger and fear.
GABBY: What were the challenges and struggles?
MRS. WOMBLE: I think some of the challenges once you got there was just to
um…kind of prove that you had a right to be there. You know, you were there
to learn, you should be afforded the same opportunities that everybody else.
And I think some of the challenges – you know kids…they were wondering,
“Well who were we and what were we doing there?” and we were wondering the
same thing. I think from the teachers’ standpoint, my experience is you – at
that time Mr. Griggs was there – I think he was the dean of students? He was
one of the dean of students so you know, I knew him and he knew my family
from B.T. Washington days. So you still had some people that were in a sense
kind of looking out for you, making sure you were where you was supposed to
be, were doing the right thing, if you had concerns you could always come to
those key people and then I think there were other teachers and counselors
who maybe consciously or subconsciously weren’t quite sure how they were
going to handle having black kids in the school and what that meant overall.
I do – and I know that I’m rambling here but I’m remembering some things as
I’m talking – I remember a high school counselor of mine and I went through
sophomore – well not sophomore I’m sorry – through junior and then high
school – the highest level through 12th grade without taking much math
because if he would ask me at the time when you were supposed to sign up for
classes – if you wanted to take math – and I happened to say no, I didn’t
have to take math. Now that – at high school you think, “Oh that’s cool. I
don’t have to deal with that if I don’t want to.” But the end result of that
is that by the time I was ready to go to college, I was thinking about doing
those kinds of things, I had some serious back tracking to do as far as
playing catch up goes.
GABBY: Do you have any stories about – that happened in Centennial about
racism?
MRS. WOMBLE: Mmm...the one that I just shared is the one that sticks out in
my mind most. Just the fact that a counselor felt it was ok to sign me up
for an art class because I didn’t want to take math…I thought that was – at
the time it didn’t strike me on how important and how wrong that was, but
when I think about it I think that’s one of the things that sticks out in my
mind as far as being at Centennial. Being at Central, I don’t know do they
still have Black History Month or Afro-American clubs at the schools? Do
they? I think at Central High School we had – I know we had one at Central
High School and Mrs. Blackwell was one of the teachers. I think she was an
English teacher but it was also her responsibility or maybe she volunteered
to oversee that program. I could remember it starting off – you know
everybody was really interested, “What were we going to do? What were we
going to discuss? What was going to be our – you know, kind of agenda? And
as things kind of went on towards the end of the school year I think people
were just really relaxed about what it meant. And I remember this Native
American guy that was – had just moved to the area – his family had just
moved to the area – at one of our meetings…you know everybody’s – it’s after
lunch, everybody’s wound up and a little restless and not willing to settle
down and get into the meeting and I could remember Manuel standing up and
saying you know, “In my country we don’t get these opportunities to sit and
talk about what’s important to us.” And he said, “I don’t understand,” you
know I can remember him saying he didn’t understand how we didn’t feel that
was as important and that when we were given time and opportunity we didn’t
take it. So it was really – I mean you could hear a pin drop…but…it was
really interesting.
GABBY: I understand that you were bussed to Centennial. What was that like?
MRS. WOMBLE: Um…the bussing part – I really don’t remember any problems, any
situations other than having to get up extra early to make sure that I had
myself where I was supposed to be. Um, you know, it wasn’t a situation where
we had any other recourse or anything. My mom didn’t own a car, nor did she
know how to drive so it was just something that we did. By the time we got
to junior high it was the norm, whereas before it was – at Washington you
just walked right across the park and you were at school. You were ready –
when it was lunchtime you walked right back home for lunch and walked right
back across the park. So I think those were – is a little more freeing in
that sense but when you get older - who wants to go home for lunch? <laughs>
GABBY: How were you treated when you got off the bus at the first day?
MRS. WOMBLE: Hard to say…I really don’t remember too much about it other
than just noting the difference between Central high school – physically,
the building – and Centennial. From Central – an older school, still
functional to Centennial – this brand spanking new school that we had to now
attend. So…
GABBY: Did you know why you were bussed?
MRS. WOMBLE: No, I didn’t. I actually – I don’t think I really thought about
it. I think it was just – you know I was pretty much used to – like I was
saying before how I had brothers and sisters that ended up going to
Jefferson and Edison and I went to Franklin Middle School…we had moved a
couple of times so you know I was used to that kind of change and that kind
of situation so I don’t think I really thought about it until years later
what it was like to be bussed or have to be bussed.
KIMBERLIE: And now that you’ve thought about it how do you think? What do
you think about it now?
MRS. WOMBLE: Now that I’ve thought about it um…I don’t think it’s
necessarily a bad thing. I think the important thing that people miss is
that no matter what school you go to, everybody ahs the same opportunities.
Everybody has access to the mainstream programs as well as the special
programs where there’s collaboration with the university – to have students
come in and do a particular project or study a particular area in a
different way. So I think the key is that everybody needs to have equal
access and I think that’s what we miss a lot of times. You know, it’s not so
much where you go to school at but the fact that you get the quality
education that you’re entitled to get.
GABBY: Were blacks the only ones who were bussed?
MRS. WOMBLE: I think at that time blacks were the only ones that were bussed
and you were bussed out of your particular area or your neighborhood to
other schools.
GABBY: We heard from one student who lived in Central High School district
that was bussed to Centennial that there were racial unrest that last one
time (?) for black students and were met by angry white parents and students
often got off the bus. What do you remember about this?
MRS. WOMBLE: Again I think that was something that happened probably the
year before I started going there and I wish that I could do a – have you do
a phone interview with my older brothers because I think they would be able
to tell you a little bit more about that. By the time I got there everything
had settled and I don’t know if that particular group of students that were
angry enough to do that had graduated and moved on or just the fact that
people kind of settled and finally understood and came to turns with this is
the way that it’s going to be so…
GABBY: How difficult was it to participate in after school activities
because of bussing?
MRS. WOMBLE: Oh it was very difficult. We – it’s a pretty good stretch from
where we lived out to Centennial High School so if you didn’t have money to
catch the city bus, if you didn’t have access to a car, you pretty much
didn’t participate. It made it difficult to do.
GABBY: Were you in any activities?
MRS. WOMBLE: Um, the one or two things that I tried to do and didn’t make a
great attempt at it was cheerleading. You know, I got out and got nervous in
front of the crowd and couldn’t remember half of what I was supposed to say
or do so – no I didn’t really participate in any extra-curricular activities
in high school.
KIMBERLIE: And why was that? And what was the reason? Was it because of this
issue of transportation or was it something else?
MRS. WOMBLE: Some of it – most of it was the issue of transportation, yeah.
Because like I was saying unless your parents had a car or you could carpool
with someone you know, you had the money to catch the city bus, it was
pretty difficult because you lived really far – very far away from the
schools. And a lot of times it meant after late hours and – it was just not
a easy situation to take advantage of.
GABBY: How did your experience with desegregation affect your life today –
then and today?
MRS. WOMBLE: Then I think it – there’s some things that when you’re growing
up you don’t really pay that much attention to just because that’s not your
– you’re not able to understand a lot of what’s going on. I mean you see it
and you know it may give you an awkward feeling or it may make you stop and
think about something again but you don’t quite have the ability to reason
it all out yet and say, “Ahh, ah-hah – that’s what that was,” until you get
older and you start thinking about things. So then I think that was pretty
much the way it was and it may be the same way for kids today unless you
experience something that’s really blatant like um – being made to sit in a
certain area in the classroom instead of being invited to sit up front –
that kind of thing. Or – I can’t think of any other examples but um…the way
that it’s affected me now is that – you know because I think about some of
the opportunities missed maybe…not just for myself but for some of my
classmates. And I think that you don’t quite realize the affect that you’re
having on another human being when you’re treating them a particular way
just because of the way that they look. I don’t think people really stop and
try and understand what kind of an impact that might have long term.
GABBY: How was the desegregation plan explained to you?
MRS. WOMBLE: Mmm…I think I remember – I don’t remember one particular person
sitting me down and saying, “Now this is what this is all about, this is why
we’re going to be bussing.” I remember hearing bits and pieces or seeing –
like my mom and my aunt watching different things on the news about the
happenings – what was going on pretty much all over the country, not just in
Illinois and in Champaign and Urbana. But again as a kid you don’t really
focus on that, you don’t really zero in on those things and until you start
experiencing some things you may think about it for a minute and you – it
makes you feel awkward but you’re not quite sure why. And then as you get
older and you look back on those things, then you understand ok, that was
the difference and the difference was just the fact that I look different
from someone else.
GABBY: How involved were your parents in your school education?
MRS. WOMBLE: Um, my mom was pretty involved. She was a single parent for a
while and there were five of us so she made sure if there was something that
we had an interest in that she would do her best to try and make that happen
for us. And as I’m saying that I remember at B.T. Washington there were
opportunities for me probably because we lived right across the park from
the school. I took violin lessons – didn’t stick with it but had the
opportunity to do it and my sister – what did she study? I think she studied
cello…yeah. And I think my brothers were both involved in sports and boy
scouts was a big thing. So the opportunities seemed to exist a little bit
more when we were in elementary school than when we were in a neighborhood
school situation as opposed to once we got to high school.
GABBY: I play the violin.
MRS. WOMBLE: Oh ok. You still play?
GABBY: Yeah.
MRS. WOMBLE: Excellent.
GABBY: Um, did your mom believe in desegregation?
MRS. WOMBLE: Uh, I am not sure how she felt about it; we haven’t had that
conversation. I think that – when people start – I do know when people start
talking about school of choice and also start talking about the – oh it’s
not the magnet schools but the um-
GABBY: High(?)?
MRS. WOMBLE: When you choose like Barkstall or Stratton?
GABBY: Not nec – that’s more school of choice but – charter schools. Um,
when people start having conversations about charter schools – I’ve heard
her have conversations and I think it – to her it seems that for all that
people have struggled for, she goes back to the whole idea of equal access
for everybody because there’s – I think she’s concerned – she’s talked about
being concerned about with the charter schools how there’s not guarantee
that the same books, the same access to the computer software programs are
going to be made available through those programs to those students at those
schools same as they are the other schools. So, that would be the comment I
would make on that.
GABBY: Um, I had a question. What are charter schools?
MRS. WOMBLE: I think charter schools are primarily when people get together
and decide in a community that they want a school that represents their
community, that focuses on that particular population and is available in
that area.
GABBY: Do you believe in desegregation and why did some people want it and
others didn’t?
MRS. WOMBLE: Um, again I believe in equal access for everybody. I think some
people want it because of the fear of making sure – you know back in the day
when – before black people were allowed to attend school, you got access to
some books but it was a hand-me-down books, you got access to some materials
but it wasn’t the best material. The students from the university went to
the schools that were able to offer them either an internship where they
learn as they’re teaching – they get on-the-job experience by teaching…the
money is there so you’re able to get the better software systems for the
computers, you get the upgrades – they’re maintained…all of that. And I
think there’s a real fear that all of that would not be made available if
schools were not segregated.
GABBY: What did you think of the desegregation plan?
MRS. WOMBLE: I’m not quite sure, I have mixed feelings about it. I think
that for a lot of students it would do a world of good to be in a situation
or to at least have some of the same kind of experience that we had when we
were going up with B.T. Washington. The fact that - if the principal there
for example – Mrs. Wesley – if there were students who didn’t have coats or
shoes or whatever, she did a canvas through the community and people go
together and they had whatever it was that they needed. It may not have been
the best, it may not have been the brand spanking new from Sears and Roebuck
but you got – you were taken care of and I think people had more of a vested
interest in your education. We even had um – we talked about Mr. Griggs
earlier…his wife ran a program through the – through B.T. Washington that
was called charm club and he ran a program called the Esquire Club and what
he did – he worked with the boys and taught them etiquette and personal
hygiene and all of that kind of thing and then did some fun stuff in the
community like field trips after school or on the weekends. And what Mrs.
Griggs did was pretty much the same thing but the focus was on girls – you
know on hygiene, on etiquette – that kind of thing. And at the end of the
year – to celebrate your completion of being in those programs we went to a
place called The Red Wood in and I think it’s near – it’s between Champaign
and Kankakee and it’s just a little restaurant. They have a buffet but the
food was pretty good and that was our end of the year outing. Well the guys
had to make sure that they pull the seat out for you, if you needed
something to drink they would offer to go up and get it for you, you learned
which was the salad fork, which was the dinner fork – I mean just little
stuff like that. And I think there’s a continuation of that similar kind of
program with the Cotillion that happens. But again, that was something that
they felt was necessary and they took it upon themselves as members of the
community to do for the black kids and it was a really good program.
GABBY: What do you think others thought of the desegregation plan?
MRS. WOMBLE: Could you repeat that? I’m sorry.
GABBY: What do you think others thought of the desegregation plan?
MRS. WOMBLE: I think a lot of people had a lot of mixed feelings. I remember
not too long ago talking with some of the teachers – and these are ladies
that were all members of a book club. Some of them teach at the college
level, some at Parkland, some at the high school – excuse me – and we’ve all
had conversations about, “Is it good? Was it worth it? Would we have been
better off without segregation as far as education goes?” And a lot of
people have really strong feelings that no, we’re not. That when you get
information about you, by you, from people that look like you it kind of
makes a difference…it kind of makes a difference because you have a vested
interest, you think, “Oh, ok that’s representing me.” Not that that’s all
there is to this world but at least you are understanding – it gives you a
foundation for understanding where you’re at in the world. So some of the
ladies have had really strong conversations about that as well as the other
side – just the fact that the whole point was for equal access. Well, in
some respects we have equal aspects but in some respects we still have some
work to do.
DANIELLE: Um, I had a question. Um, do you think that when we have black
history month and stuff…and when they – when teachers consistently go over
the same black personality like Thurgood Marshall and Rosa Parks or
somebody, the same month every time you go to school…do you think that’s
kind of an insult to black history that we only get to learn about it during
one month and not during the whole other eight months of school?
MRS. WOMBLE: Well I don’t – I don’t know if I’d look at it so much as a
insult…certainly there’s more information out there than you can fit in 28
days. There are more people that contributed to the building of this country
than the few that they continually mention so in that respect yes, they are
doing a little bit of a disservice but I guess the flipside of that is that
everybody can take it upon themselves to decide how I wanna deal with this.
Is it important enough for me to research and find out on my own? And I
think some of that’s available at the college level, some of it’s available
at the high school level and I was – it’s funny that you mention that. I was
listening to WBCP the other day – on their talk program – and it might have
been…I wanna say Vernessa(?) Gibson with the Urban League and she was
talking about how they were selling all of these – you know the little
magnetic stickers that you see on the back of people’s cars? Some “Save the
Troops,” some for breast cancer awareness…there’s one that they’re selling
through the Urban League now and it’s called Black History 365 – in other
words, celebrate black history 365 days a year and start putting that into
people’s minds because I think a lot gets missed like you said when people
present the same information a certain time of the year and that’s all you
hear about it. How do you feel about that? Do you think it’s fair? Do you
think they should do more? Do you think students understand the importance
of it?
DANIELLE: Um, well – it’s like – well I asked my social studies teacher
about it and – well I know last year we didn’t learn about it at all during
– even during black history month and this year I asked my social studies
teacher about it and she said, “Well, I have to go by the curriculum and if
the curriculum says that we go over this then that’s what we have to go
over.” And I think that it should be brought up at the school board that we
need to learn about more African Americans because I know now they’re
stressing that we learn about more Native Americans and Hispanics and stuff
like that.
MRS. WOMBLE: Right. Right, I’d agree. And it might a thing if you ever have
an opportunity to do a class project. Do your – take your project and focus
as long as you’re meeting the guidelines of what’s required for it. Focus it
on something that’s important to you and that’s relevant to you and not as a
protest but talk with your teacher and say, “Well I’m interested in the
subject but here’s how it’s relevant to me and this is how I’d like to write
it. This is what I’d like to research on.
GABBY: Who in the community wanted desegregation and who didn’t want it?
MRS. WOMBLE: Mmm…I think there was probably a mix. Certainly there were
whites in the community that clearly did not want it and I think those
attitudes trickled down to their children, hence the riots at the schools. I
think there were probably black folks in the community that were unsure if
it was the right thing for their kids to do – just the whole uncertainty of
it and understanding how difficult a choice that is to make for their
children. So I think there was a lot of that going on from both sides and
from all sides. And then I think there were probably just as many or a few
that felt like they could see – they had the vision to see that it could be
a good thing if it’s handled and directed in the right way.
GABBY: Did the schools in black neighborhoods survive after desegregation?
What new – were new schools built?
MRS. WOMBLE: There were no new schools that were built that I know of other
than Centennial. There used to be some other schools that existed in the
area near Douglas – where they have their parking lot on the one side of 5th
Street used to be a school. A few blocks down there used to be another
school where Salem Church parking lot is located and I don’t remember the
names. I think Lawhead was one of them. So those schools existed but we’re
talking like in my parents’ high school years. And I think it did affect the
black community because – just like with some of the housing situations,
once they are taken over or condemned or what have you they’re torn down and
nothing gets put in its place. So for years you’d have vacant lots and I
think it does something to see that when you grow up in a community year
after year after year and you come back as an adult and a lot ahs not
changed as far as just the physical look of the place – there’s no new
growth, there’s not much new development with the exception of the Martin
Luther King subdivision and of course now with – oh I cant think of the name
of the apartments that were on…Bradley…um – <inaudible> Manor. Once those
were tore down – now they’re starting to build some house but you know, the
whole face of the community has changed so much. When I was growing up there
were not apartment complexes on the north end – not that I remember. With
the exception of maybe Burch Village and it was a much nicer place than
probably what you remember – what you’d remember it being. You know, people
took interest in their yards, people had flowers growing and – like I said
it was just a whole different feel. It was a lot different.
GABBY: What was school like for you after desegregation?
MRS. WOMBLE: Mmm…after desegregation I guess it was, you know – school was
school with the exception of not seeing as many faces in the class that
looked like me. You know – having teachers who - you had some teachers that
were Hispanic – not very many, you had more that were white and then you had
a few that were African American so….
DANIELLE: You said that we could talk to your brother about desegregation
and interview him but do you have any other parents or students that were
affected by desegregation that we could talk to?
MRS. WOMBLE: Oh sure. Um, both my sisters are here – still live in the
community or have moved back to the community rather. I could certainly ask
them – both my brothers have moved out of the area but I think their
experiences would be a little more unique to some of the issues that you
raised through the questions. Like I said, by the time that I was bussed to
school things had pretty much settled as far as any race issues. You know
there were the more quiet undertone kind of things…like maybe you weren’t
encouraged to take the higher-level classes – you know, that kind of thing.
Or you weren’t encouraged to take math if you didn’t want to take math, how
about workshop? You wanna go build some things with wood? Ok, sure fine…but
in the long run what does that do to you? By the time I went to Parkland –
realizing that I need to take some higher-level classes and not being able
to do the math – that was a struggle for me to realize that here I’m in
college and I’m being tested and I was at that time tested at a 6th grade
level. You know, so yeah I start thinking about my high school counselor at
that time…yeah.
GABBY: Ok, so we want to thank you for coming down here and letting us
interview today.
MRS. WOMBLE: Oh, you’re welcome and like I said I will try and touch bases
with my brothers and sisters and encourage them to come and participate in
the interview. And thank you for asking me.
GABBY: Ok. You’re welcome. Thank you.
END
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